What can you do to become a better teacher? Here’s an encore interview between Francis Kong and Jennifer Tzeng, who spoke at the Imagine Talks symposium. Jennifer Tzeng is the owner of Tzeng Violin Studio located in Palo Alto.
She began her private violin studies at age five and was the youngest member of the Strolling Strings, a performance group by age six. Her previous violin instructors include Anne Crowden, Dan Kobialka, Zak Grafilo, James Greening-Valenzuela, and Leon Igudesman. Jennifer has had extensive performing experiences in orchestras, beginning her orchestral training at age of seven, being the youngest member of the Contra Costa Chamber Orchestra.
Find out more about Jennifer Tzeng:
Jennifer Tzeng’s Violin Studio 👉🏻 https://www.tzengmusic.com/
Fireside chat with Jennifer Tzeng
Francis Kong: Hello, Jen, how are you doing?
Jennifer Tzeng: I am doing very well, Francis Thank you for asking. How are you?
Francis Kong: I’m doing well and it’s so wonderful to see you again, even if it’s virtually and you have— you’re an Imagine Talks alumni, actually, like I believe the last time we had you on our stage was, I believe, 2017, where you gave one of my favorite talks of all times. And I and I still go back and watch and share that talk, like even to this very day. And I wonder if you don’t mind giving a brief introduction to yourself and just a little review of what you shared in your Imagine Talks in 2017 with us.
Jennifer Tzeng: Sure, so I’m Jennifer and I teach violin in Palo Alto. I’ve been working on a methodology for how to teach violin for the last 11 years now and that say, in 2017, when I did my Imagine Talks, I came out for the first time and talked about sexual trauma that I had dealt with at a young age and how I overcame that through teaching. And I talked a little bit about my teaching methodology and what I was working on and fast forward, here we are four years later.
Francis Kong: Wow. All right. Yeah. And I’m going to see if we can have a link somewhere here for people to go and watch that talk. It really is one of the most, I think, inspiring and moving talks I’ve ever been involved with. Again, thank you for sharing that. So since then, in 2017, now it’s 2021, what have you been exploring since then?
Discovering more about what you are passionate about
Jennifer Tzeng: Well, I have been continuing on with methodology, doing a lot of research into body anatomy, more so, even more into the brain. I talk about the senses and such in 2017, the physics of how sound is produced, just a lot of stuff, a lot of stuff. I’ve done some music camps. I did a music camp for cooking and music—or it was called Nom Nom Music—where the kids came and they played orchestral pieces, they did chamber music and then they learned how to cook as well and learned about different ingredients and how to eat healthy and all that jazz. That was really, really fun.
I also started heading the After-School Strings program with the Saratoga Unified School District, where I’m teaching like 60 fourth- and fifth-graders. It’s like a huge, like, violin, viola, cello, bass before COVID happened. But yeah, it’s just been very, very exciting and very, very fast. I feel like—like, 2017 and now it’s 2021, like just passed like that, it’s just been a lot of teaching and learning.
Francis Kong: Wow. OK, great. So now teaching and learning has always been, at least from me falling on parts on your career, teaching and learning has always been such a integral and almost like very focal point of your philosophy, your mission. What would you say is one of your core philosophies in terms of what teaching is, and what learning is, and how to actually truly connect with each other in your discovery of this art form and science?
The core philosophies in terms of the art of teaching
Jennifer Tzeng: OK, wow, that’s a long question. Well, I think one of my main philosophies that I realized this year is that, I asked myself in 2010, what is the first step to teaching violin? And that alone has let me down this journey on this path of all these learning and— really, really cool, exciting stuff.
But I learned this year that I think one of my main philosophies is: as a teacher, first and foremost, you need to connect with the student on a personal level. And of course, in order to do that, you also have to be connected with yourself. That’s one of my main philosophies.
Secondly, it would be, my —we’ve talked a lot throughout this year, Francis—and my main philosophy with how I approach teaching is understanding the “how.” Like, how to do something. That’s like with teaching violin, for instance, like instrument that many think is impossibly difficult to learn and you’re going to sound terrible for X amount of years. But my approach is understanding our bodies like body and anatomy, understanding your brain, how it works, understanding how your brain connects to your body, understanding energy use and time perception.
I often tell my students it’s kind of like a —Iron Man, like, “Hey, you’re Tony Stark and Jarvis is your brain and your body is your Iron Man suit, right?” You want to have a general understanding of them, so, therefore, they can work together as a team and therefore help you actually learn how to play and not sound like crap. (Is that a bad word?) And sound bad for X amount of years. Another thing I’ve been doing is I’ve been learning left-hand violin, I’ve been learning how to teach myself violin backwards, which is very exciting.
Experimenting with the whole process of learning
Francis Kong: So with the left-hand violin, it sounds like you’re almost exploring and experimenting on the whole process of learning.
Let me backtrack a little bit here, because you brought something up, some very interesting topics before. It seems like before you even teach something, a skill set to a student, what you actually do is go back several steps further and say, “Do you understand how your body and your mind actually work together in the first place?” Like Jarvis and Iron Man suit, that analogy.
So what exactly do you think is missing in many of our students today in terms of understanding how they are supposed to learn in the first place?
Jennifer Tzeng: Well, if I were to be specific as to the violin, it goes straight to what to do. Without teaching the how or understanding how to do something like, OK, for violin, for instance, when you get into a position. Right?
And you’re teaching how to get into position. So if you’re not teaching them to understand all the different parts of their arm, or even like your hands, to the thumb of your hand, like web spaces, your joints, which allow us to move, right? And how many joints that they have and different rotations, then they’re not going to be able to utilize their arm to the fullest potential.
Understanding your passion in its entirety
And when you’re learning a violin, you have to. This is why a lot of people don’t sound very good in the beginning. Just makes—five years ago, I would think like, “Why? Why are we learning all this?” It just makes sense that if you’re learning—if you’re teaching how to play the violin, you should have — you should understand all the parts of your arm or how many joints do you have. Your brain and where in your brain connects to your arms, or to even, like, how your ears work. And I’ve seen, like throughout—especially even this year, teaching virtually, understanding of these things, actually fixes so many issues, I think that many bump into when they’re learning.
So, yeah, it’s like you want to— we take our bodies for granted, even if you think about— I often see other teachers telling students, “Hey, you have to concentrate, OK? Can you make sure you focus?” I’m —OK, as an adult and like living in the social age that we are with social media and like digital like the digital age, I believe as adults we even have trouble focusing. So it’s like, how are you going to tell a six-year-old, “Can you please focus and concentrate?” It’s like, well, how? Like how do you focus? How do you concentrate? Teach them like or how they can even—Motchi’s licking his bowl—
Back to what I was saying— my dog is licking his breakfast bowl—so teaching them how to do things like I mean, if you want to tell a student to read, right?
Francis Kong: You can go ahead and take care of Mochi and I can pause this.
Jennifer Tzeng: To this moment—
Developing the art of learning
Francis Kong: You were saying about understanding how to learn like basically like, for example, trying to have a focus, right? When someone says, “You focus.” But we don’t even necessarily understand what that means or how to do that in the first place.
Jennifer Tzeng: Yeah, exactly. It becomes the learning and like children in school, you know, telling them to concentrate or teaching them how to read or we just take like these things like our senses for granted, I think, instead of like, “Hey, if you’re going to teach a student how to read, maybe teach them a little bit about their eyes.” Like very simple, basic, like, “Hey, you have two lenses per eye, you know, process back here in your occipital lobe, knows and energy that way.
Or again, back to the whole “how to concentrate.” That takes, like, I think like meditation, like kids meditation and training. It’s not something that we’re just born with knowing. So I think that with violin, it’s, you know, you’re basically put into a position where it looks like OK, without understanding anything internally and like maybe things not even connecting just because you look like it’s OK on the outside—everything inside can be wrong.
Like, you know, sure, I can I can get on a snowboard and, like, make a pose and look like I know what I’m doing, but you put me on a mountain and it might not be so great.
The art of learning begins with understanding your equipment
Francis Kong: So I want to ask you, why don’t we actually have more programs— we have programs in place, obviously, and how to teach things. But why don’t we have programs in place, you think, a society on how to first understand the process of learning? Even as a child, like, “This is how you focus. This [is] how you—this is how your eyes operate. This [is] how you work in terms of your bodies and your muscles.” Like, why is not understanding your equipment in the first place, something [like] that, is actually in the very foundation of our curriculum?
Jennifer Tzeng: I think that it’s just world curriculum —the thing about school and how schools run, I think that’s very antiquated. I think we just don’t know or don’t think of these things and I think that we are coming a time period where more people, more and more people are thinking like this. Like, Jim Kwik, and the whole, like, the how-to-learn, how-to-speed-read, how-to-memorize, how-to-use-your-brain. Like, when I discovered his book this year, I was like, “Oh, my God, this is awesome.”
I think that we’re coming at a time where people are actually thinking about these things. And because we are so connected through the Web that it’s great because people can exchange information and I believe, like, this is going to be a new start to more of understanding ourselves and our brains. And therefore, like, learning and growing more and progressing as a race and hopefully leading to more happy, I guess, fulfilled people, again, you know, through the learning.
Moving in the direction of learning more about ourselves
And I—yeah, I do believe this is we’re on the brink of this, like a movement towards that direction because, you know, if you think about really back in the day with school, kids used to sit in adult-sized chairs. And then they would be teeter-tottering, and until somebody—what was that at the Montessori—until somebody came along and said, “Hey, why don’t we make kid-sized chairs?” Right? And like, now you think of it and you’re like, “Well, duh.” That way they can actually focus a little bit better because they’re sitting comfortably rather than balancing on a chair and then trying to learn stuff.
But before someone had that idea of, “Hey, why don’t we make smaller chairs?” Nobody would have thought of that. And I believe, like now with the whole like more of mental health, all of this and like meditation and learning about ourselves, people like Jim Kwik, that we will go in that direction.
Francis Kong: OK. So, then let me ask you this, what is something that you seem like some of the— I guess results that you see, especially now—such that you’re a teacher now— to students who are not properly taught how to learn in the first place, and to [be] put in a situation where they need to be taught something, what do you see emotionally and mentally and spiritually going on and happening to a child when they’re hitting those kinds of blocks? Because the basic tools were not in place, what do you see happening to them in terms of their self-value and confidence?
The art of learning is largely influenced by methods
Jennifer Tzeng: Well, what happens then, obviously, I think it goes down—they think that they’re not good enough or then they just think that they— I’ve gotten several students before that’s like, “Well, I just suck. I’m not good at it or this.” And I’m like, “No, it’s not that you suck. It’s just we haven’t figured out a method.” You know, that’s all.
And then I think that it doesn’t matter what they’re doing, learning violin or struggling in school. Whatever— what I think when especially younger children, sometimes they struggle with things that really, really has a profound impact on how they —their lens and how they see themselves and their capabilities throughout life. So I think it’s even more so important that they—that we find a method, I guess, that allows people to learn and grow to feel good about themselves.
Francis Kong: So it sounds like one of the importance of this—at least what I’m getting from here and I couldn’t agree with you more—is that, why it’s so important— the whole teaching process right now is flawed, because we— actually, there’s a three— I think it’s a three-part condition of what you’re saying is learning how to—or teaching a person how to learn in the first place. And then once that’s in place, then teach them the skill you want to and then from there, that connects to actual confidence and some value, right?
Methodology as a key component in the art of learning
And but what we do is we just basically focus straight on into the second part. We just teach a skill. And what I’m hearing is that the danger of that is that the foundation is not there. And if that is not there, that results in— you have an outcome one way or another. It’s just that you can have a bad outcome now, which means that there is no self value, there is no confidence, there is no sense of achievement now. And that if it happens especially early on, no matter what it is, science and math or music, that affects a child and therefore eventually the adults sense of value in society.
Jennifer Tzeng: Yeah, completely. I completely agree. That’s exactly on point. And I mean, just teaching a skill to like—then how to teach is to teach how, right? To do something and I like— I have to say, I as a violin teacher, again, if you don’t understand your arm, anatomy, your body, it doesn’t even matter. It’s not just a violin. It’s like anything that you do because we use our bodies every day.
If you don’t have a general understanding of even how to breathe, where are lungs are, this— I just, yeah, it seems like, why isn’t this taught in school? Something that will be taught and methodology’s important to the teaching.
Methodologies are needed to explain “how to” in the art of learning
And I believe that methodology should teach the “how to” just because I mean, this year since, we’ve been in quarantine, I’ve been doing a lot of meditation, which has been awesome, has had such a positive impact on my life for such little like 20 minutes a day. 20 minutes a day and like the overall effect that it has, it’s like the benefits of it, it’s like this much effort and then this much benefit, which is awesome.
When I think about, like I’ve taken one of Jim Kwik’s class, the memory manual, master class, and he has you memorizing things like 40 words out of order, 20 more. But I do that before his class, no, but with simple very, very to the point— methodology that he does and his methods, it’s like I have my six-year-olds memorizing 20 words out of order. So, see, people are capable of amazing things. If they have like the— I don’t like using those words— but like the right methodology. Yeah. So.
Francis Kong: No, that makes sense to me and I can relate because even at age of —I can remember when I was in first grade and I was thrown into lessons —first and second grade—I was thrown the lessons, and I really didn’t understand, my mom and dad really didn’t speak English at home, so I had to learn English pretty much on my own and with whatever social connections I had. And trust me, they are very far and few social connections that I had as a Chinese boy in Mississippi. A lot of instructions I got in first and second grade were very confusing to me. And of course, I got punished for not following instructions.
Jennifer Tzeng: Yeah.
Energy use: the nuances
Francis Kong: I don’t understand them, right? And so my value that I perceive for myself during those early years were at all time low. I can look back at it now, understand that wasn’t my fault, but you don’t really have those tools in that perception when you’re six and seven.
Jennifer Tzeng: I could, yeah, I could relate to that. I definitely can relate to that, that’s then you end up feeling it’s like you’re just not good enough, which is not a good feeling, because I remember getting up— now, I remember getting yelled at a lot with studying the violin when it got to very difficult technique. Now I do think that all my teachers are awesome teachers when it comes to, like, freezing, I mean, connecting with them on a personal level. But when the technique again, if you’re not connected to your body and you don’t really understand the anatomy of your hands, then it’s like...
For energy, these minute nuances of energy use, there are certain things that doesn’t matter how many hours you practice. You’re not going to get it. And what happens is, like, you work on it and then you see other kids that have more innate talent getting it, you’ll get it, and then when I say you, I’m talking about myself, and then I’m getting yelled at like, “This is like, you need to practice more, you’re not getting it.” And it’s just, like, “Maybe I just suck. Like, I’m not meant to, like, do this, you know, like, I don’t know how to play this tenth in tune when I’m very stressed out, like, you know, I, yeah.”
The art of learning is continuing to learn and looking for new ways to improve
I think that the role as a teacher is really important to that—this is completely like, kind of off-topic, Francis. But I think the role of the teachers, like or like a philosophy or mentality is to constantly be learning and trying to find another way because I really truly believe to understand your craft, you can teach it to anybody.
And if you are having difficulty teaching it to somebody, it’s because you just don’t understand it enough. And I’ve always been— I’ve always felt that way, like when I had like 56 students, you know, 30 of them are playing well, they’re getting it and others like 26 are still struggling. I’m like, “There’s something wrong with the teacher.” Well, maybe not wrong, but I still need to grow. I still have more to learn, you know.
And what’s great is the more and more I research to —or I learn trying to help my students, I —it’s like this —like exponential like cycling effect where I’m like, “Oh my gosh, I never thought about it this way.” And then I become better. And then everyone else in my studio gets better and then we all feel better about our playing and it’s like, “Oh my gosh, who would have thought this works?” Like, “Are you crazy? This is like nuts,” you know?
But I have to say role as a teacher is if —I do think that is to be supportive and to be able to communicate, especially if you’re teaching something difficult like the violin, that if a student is struggling in your class, that you need to find another way, like search for another way, you know.
The art of learning is a never-ending process
I think that when teachers chalk it up to, well, to students, it’s not working. Or, or, like they’re just not meant to play, and everyone’s meant to play. There’s music in all of us you know, it’s just because you don’t know your craft enough.
But I —learning and teaching, it’s always progressing. And that doesn’t matter like, what I eventually when I come out with my books, methodology—on violin methodology and with my teaching ways, I guess, little body anatomy and understanding the brain, this is only a stepping stone. I always tell my students, like later on, like, you know, “Who knows? I hope one of them takes this and goes further and learns even more.” You know, it’s never-ending, right? And I think that that’s the point.
But sometimes I believe that being a teacher or maybe from my own experiences with adults, even though I’m an adult today, is this idea of knowing everything, of always being right. And then that’s dangerous because they —if you stop learning and stop growing, or if you think you know everything, you’re actually not kind of just staying in one spot, people think that it’s like, “Fine, I’m not learning anything.” You’re actually—because everything’s progressing, right? Time’s always moving. You’re actually going backwards—digressing.
So, yeah. And plus, I see myself in my students when they struggle because I know what it feels like to struggle. And like, everything I teach them is what I hope or what I wish somebody would have taught me or what should’ve told me that, “Hey, it’s OK. I want to find another way to figure out to help you with this.” And then I wouldn’t feel so like, you know, that feeling of just not being good enough, which you also know.
The art of learning: Jennifer’s advice for students and teachers
Francis Kong: Absolutely. So going forward and we’ve learned here from 2020 in to, well, our next few years coming out of that, what is some final advice you would give to both students and teachers in order to create a more holistic, healthy, more confident, and self-valued community? Based on everything: your philosophy of learning and teaching as both as...Because it sounds like that you’re saying—and I love that—that teachers are also always students themselves as well too, which I love. So what piece of advice would you give to students and teachers going forward to create a healthier and more spiritually sound and self-confident community?
Jennifer Tzeng: Well, I think that that’s a very easy answer and very simple answer, and it’s just to meditate and to be connected with yourself, to remember to breathe. You know, do you think that you love? Learn something new, because I think that all these things holistically, when you are learning new things and you’re doing things that you love and then you are taking daily time to meditate and be connected with yourself. Ultimately, that equals the happier you. And happier you equals a happier everyone. So I think that that would be it.
I mean, I’m trying to get my students to meditate and they’re like, “Really, Teacher Jen?” I’m like, “Yes, one minute. Just one minute.” You know, get them started and it’s so important to just take time-out for yourself, you know, and to—yeah, get some headspace.
Developing your own style of play
Francis Kong: I love that. Thank you always for giving such an amazing advice, not just as a teacher, but also as a fellow student yourself. I hope to be able to see you in person again in 2021 and 2022, all the years coming. And thank you again for all the wonderful work you do with our youth in the community and you take care and I hope to see you again soon, Okay?
Jennifer Tzeng: All right. Thank you so much for having me, Francis.
Francis Kong: Always likewise and oh, before we depart, there is something that you can share with us in terms of a performance, I believe.
Jennifer Tzeng: Yes, I will be playing two pieces and you want me to talk a little bit about them?
Francis Kong: Sure, yes. Tell us a bit about these pieces.
Jennifer Tzeng: So I’ll be playing, well, OK, rewind 2017, I played some Lindsey Stirling pieces after my talk with a little bit of improv in there, and this year I have been doing a ton of improv and learning and listening to all genres of music, learning kind of like my own style of playing, so I guess you can say it’s kind of like composing, but instead of composing, I’m actually playing and improvising and then coming up with music that way. It’s like a reverse kind of composition.
Jennifer’s first improv
But I’ll be playing to two pieces: one is —one that was hugely— had a huge impact on me this year. It’s actually a single by Chloe Flower. She is a creative American pianist. She performed with Cardi B at the Grammys, she’s awesome. I’ll be playing with one of her singles, No Limit. And yeah, that was my first improv that I did, where I have transcribed to music, so [it’s] near and dear to me. I did it in one take and it was just awesome.
And Sony— actually Sony Master— Sony Works, they reached out to me to do an improv with her single, so I’m so thankful for, like, Instagram that we can all reach each other, because if they didn’t reach out to me, I probably would have heard about her piece much later. So I’ll be doing that. And then, I’ll be playing to also a hip-hop style beat, which is not typically my thing. I don’t listen to a lot of hip-hop music. But I’ll be playing with a beat called 16 from [inaudible], which he is also an Asian American hip hop beats artist.
Wow, I love that I can’t wait to hear those and that —
But that [inaudible] one is transcribed my improv that I composed for Chloe Flower and then the one that I’m going to be playing with, Kado’s track is just going to be—I’ll just be improvising.
The art of learning: keeping yourself engaged
Francis Kong: I can’t wait to hear those. And I love and you —you’re living with exactly what you preach, which is you have to constantly involve yourself and move for a time. Otherwise, if you just say what you do and what you know, time moves past you and you actually go backwards, right? So, yeah, this is...this is something that I can’t wait to see. I can’t wait to hear your new style and comparing it to what you did in 2017 and just see how you’ve evolved and grown yourself into your new form. So that’s so exciting. So yeah, I can wait to see and hear this.
Jennifer Tzeng: Awesome, well, I can’t wait to play.
Francis Kong: All right, you take care, I’ll talk to you again soon. Bye, Jen.
Jennifer Tzeng: Bye.
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